Saturday, February 2, 2013
Pleasure
Conclusion: Pleasure is not absolutely bad when considering the source or species.
I. Proper pleasure increases our activity in things we enjoy doing most. (implicit) Book X, Chpt 4. Pg 157; 30
A. Said activities can then be impeded by pleasures from others. (explicit) Book X Chpt. 5. Pg 160; 5
1. A musician's conversation can be interfered by someone in the distance playing a flute as his interest/pleasure lies with the instrument, versus his current conversation. (explicit) Book X Chpt. 5. Pg 160; 5
2. One would not live a life with a child's mind set, taking as much pleasure as possible; even if he would never suffer from it; in turn pleasing oneself even if while doing utterly shameful actions. (explcit) Book X Chpt 4. Pg 157; 1174a
II. Why shouldn't pleasure admit any more or less then health; although it is definite? (explicit) Book X Chpt. 3 Pg 155; 25
A. Good is said to be definite, whereas pleasure is not because it admits to more or less. (explicit) Book X Chpt. 3Pg155; 20
1. What may good for one (pleasant in sense, taste, sight, etc) may not be for another. (implicit) Book X Chpt. 3 Pg 156; 20
2. Just as wealth is desirable; if one has to betray another, it is not to be considered. Book X Chpt 4 Pg 157; 1173b 25
B. Those that come from either shameful or fine backgrounds are not considered to seek or have the same pleasures. (explicit) Book X Chpt 4 Pg 157; 30
1. A friend will tend to aim at what it is good versus a flatterer who will aim to please and said friend would then be praised; with the flatterer being criticized as they are both assumed to have different aims (one good, the other wrong). (explicit) Book X Chpt. 4 Pg 157; 1174a
III. Eudoxus thought pleasure to be the good. (explicit) Book X Chpt. 2 Pg 154; 10
A. He felt that all rational and nonrational animals seeked pleasure and in everything (he says) whats considered choiceworthy is good; then most choiceworthy, surpreme. (explicit) Book X Chpt. 2 Pg 154; 10
1. The fact that all animals are drawn to pleasure (in his view), indicates best for all since each finds/seeks it's own good (i.e. nourishment), and what is good for all or ultimately aimed at, is the good. (explicit) Book X Chpt. 2 Pg 154; 10
B. When added to any other good, pleasure; either just or temperate, increases the good by adding itself or deemed to bemore choiceworthy. (explicit) Book X Chpt. 2 Pg 154; 25
1. Evidently then we avoid pleasure as an evil and choose pleasure as a good with one oposing the other. (explicit) Book X Chpt 2 Pg 155; 10
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After reading Mayrie Boykins argumentative outline on Pleasure, I liked her quoting of "Evidently then we avoid pleasure as an evil and choose pleasure as a good with one opposing the other."(explicit) BOOK X Chpt 2 pg 155;10 to be quite interesting and a twist to the concept of pleasure always being good especially nowadays.
ReplyDeleteIn her other quoting of "What may be good for one (pleasant in sense, taste, sight, etc.)may not be for another" (implicit) BOOK X Chap 3 pg 156;20 I see this as a fallacy of the concept that everyone is different while in fact a lot of people are similar in many ways. For example even if you are poor or rich, people still strive to be happy or try to make others happy. They desire to have the finer things in life such as money, cars, or a house, the whole "American Dream" that is taught to us a very young age.
I agree with Eudoxus that “pleasure is the good” and there’s nothing wrong with yielding to your pleasure. (Book X:2) The problem is that we allow our pleasure to go to the excess. Pleasure doesn’t know any limits and it determines our activity. I do agree with you that what gives us the most pleasure is that which we spend our time in the activity. Spending time in activity that brings us pleasure shouldn’t be condemned. If something brought you pain would you want the majority of your time spent in that activity? I think we will all choose to spend our activity in things that brings pleasure. We just need to know how to balance pleasure and not abuse it.
ReplyDeleteSummary:
ReplyDeletePleasure is the natural accompaniment of a particular activity it is not continuous but dependent on executed actions. Pleasure is neither good nor bad and it should not be sought for the sake of pleasure but in order to achieve happiness. Having the appropriate desire for pleasure is associated with virtue. Precision in the activity is increased by the pleasure sensed throughout the duration of the activity. Since there are different activities and different levels of pleasure for each individual activity the pleasure sought should reflect the positive, negative or neutral nature of the activity and not an excess.
I agree with Mayrie Boykins argumentative outline on Pleasures. In particular the quotes “Proper Pleasure increases our activity in things we enjoy the most” (implicit)BookX, Chpt4. Pg 157;30 and “Said activities can be impeded by the activities of others” (explicit)BookX, Chpt. 5. Pg 160; 5 were most interesting. I find that we as a society are often so wrapped up in our own activities that we often block out or ignore other activities that we are involved in that are not activities of choice. In my opinion all premises included relate to her conclusion clearly and concisely.
ReplyDeleteShalise Coursey
ReplyDeleteI do agree with the author of “Pleasure” she really gets into the meaning and she uses the examples to best describe what pleasures are. In this society we view pleasure as doing or obtaining something for personal pleasure. In her premise she gives her opinion on Book X Chpt5 while also quoting some examples. We tend to ignore things that don’t hold our attention when there is something else playing in the background that diverts our attention. I would have never associated this to pleasure activity or reaction. I do this all time I will start doing my homework and something comes on Tv or the radio and before I know it I have lost focused on what I was doing. The music or the television pleasure destroys the activity of the book I am reading. The pleasure that I did not find in the book has been ultimately obtained by outside distractions.
“Eudoxus thought pleasure was the good” although there are both good pleasurable things and bad pleasurable things. People in general do things consciously because of the value or the pleasure they attribute to it. People identify good with what they grasp to be valuable or pleasurable and there are many kinds of things, such as activities, that human beings may hold valuable, in a number of measures. Contemplation as the activity can provide the maximum degree of happiness.
ReplyDeleteThe argument on "Pleasure" was very interesting to me. I found the quote "What may be good for one, may not be good for another" pg.156, Book X, Chapter 3, 20. This is a true statement. What may be pleasurable to a friend, family member, or co-worker may not be pleasurable to you. For example, a co-worker at your job gets a promotion which entails being able to work longer hours and being able to multitask on a consistent basis. Your coworker may find this pleasurable because they can do all that the promotion requires. She has no kids and no husband so her coming home late isn't a problem. On the other hand, you're jealous because you put in for the promotion and was looking forward to the extra money. But the thing is you don't really like staying past the hours you are scheduled to work, multitasking is not something that you can handle, and you are married with children. So in reality, the promotion favored your coworker and not you in every aspect. So what may be pleasurable for someone else may not be pleasurable to you.
ReplyDelete"Pleasure".Very interesting Dawayna. I never really looked at at it that way.I actually like this quote in Book IX chapter 4,5 pg. 142. "Futher , such person finds it pleasant to spend time with himself,and so wishes to do it". This reminds me of myself. I find pleasure in Traveling and spending time with my family in the carribean, espically my mother.The ancient stories she relates, when I wake every morning she is sitting on my bed, even though I told her the day before that I want to sleep late. The first thing she will say to me is "Good morning, I feel like having a cup of coffee", I will smile.Some friends will tell me it makes no sense going to the same country every year, but their pleasure is not my pleasure. While i'm there I have to get a taste of the ocean where I can can go swimming, as far in the ocean as I please, I want to touch the boats way out in the ocean this makes me feel wonderful, I also prefer bathing on the beach at night for me this is very peaceful and pleasurable. Last year on my visit my son accompanied me to the beach at midnight, That day I was hungry for that ocean, hungry for the salt water,really hungry for a swim, I just had to get one in. It was so quiet and peaceful. The water was warm and and calm. For me this is pleasure.
DeleteI agree all people seek pleasure. I believe that what someone seeks pleasure in determines what is good or bad. As addressed in Boykins outline people who come from different backgrounds or walks of life find pleasure in things others may not.As Aristotle stated what is pleasurable to some may not be to others. For each kind of animal seems to have its own proper pleasure , just as it has its own proper function ; for the proper pleasure will be the one that corresponds to its activity(bookX pg 161 5:8).
ReplyDelete